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The Barbel Society-2014 Research & Conservation Online Auction Lot listing

No need for such thoughtless comments Raymondo.


Not the sort of thing I would expect from a Lone Angler Masterbait Ambassador.
 
Boiling up nicely this one , club pettiness at it's finest :( Whenever the BS crops up on BFW within a twinkling of an eye this sort of point scoring bitchiness ensues , Why ?
 
Boiling up nicely this one , club pettiness at it's finest :( Whenever the BS crops up on BFW within a twinkling of an eye this sort of point scoring bitchiness ensues , Why ?

Not sure why you would single out the BS. There are countless subjects that when raised can develop into heated debate and sometimes worse. With the BS, it always feels to me that it is the same small group that use the opportunity to dredge up history through vaguely criptic posts and sometimes not very criptic at all. Thankfully I am quite ignorant of what's gone in the past and I have no interest or desire in trying to make sense of it. I'm only interested in what's happening currently and what's to come.

But it's a forum, it's what happens and I don't really have an issue with it. Ultimately you have to respect a persons right to share a point of view. If it gets personal or abusive then of course that's quite different.
 
Hello Howard . Not singling out the BS at all , it was just an observation . I too have no knowledge of the '' history '' of all this , doesn't interest me . Yes it is a forum where debate should take place , but this thread is hardly a debate is it , what is there to debate, it's just information about an auction isn't it ? I just don't like the way that from time to time threads on BFW are hijacked and end up in a load of hand bag swinging , just seems a bit petty that's all .

I'll get me coat ......
 
Hello Howard . Not singling out the BS at all , it was just an observation . I too have no knowledge of the '' history '' of all this , doesn't interest me . Yes it is a forum where debate should take place , but this thread is hardly a debate is it , what is there to debate, it's just information about an auction isn't it ? I just don't like the way that from time to time threads on BFW are hijacked and end up in a load of hand bag swinging , just seems a bit petty that's all .

I'll get me coat ......

I can't disagree with that.
 
Hi Howard,
please can I ask a couple of GENUINE questions?

What are the benefits/reasons/advantages of joining the BS?

How does the R&C work that the BS does benefit barbel/anglers/environment?

I've been a keen barbel angler for 40 odd years and have never felt the need to join.
Have I been missing something? Or doing the future of barbel/angling a disservice by not joining?

all the best, Tim
 
Hey Tim, you should join, take a look at the RandC PROJECTS summary on the website and you will see the amount of work that has been done and is planned.
15000 barbel stocked as a result of BS funding/input, lots of habitat work in rivers completed, funding and support of 3 PhD projects related to barbel.
Give me a ring if you want any more detail!

All possible because of the genuine support of tackle trade/angling community/members that raises the funds through subscriptions, donations, raffles and the annual auction.

Many thanks to Andy at BFW for the chance to promote the auction, much appreciated.

90 lots already, we expect to have 100 plus by the end, lovely set of hand-made floats just come in, and another couple of fishing days.

Cheers,

Pete
 
Dear Howard,
Thank you for your reasoned and polite reply. In answer to your paragraph quoted below;

“You say in your post that you are concerned, which I take positively because concern is typically an emotional response to caring. If you care about something then you consider its wellbeing and in doing so presumably want it to survive and flourish. To my mind, this means having a far greater focus on the future and not being paralysed by the past.â€

I have been concerned about rivers for as long as I can remember. Indeed, this concern has been reflected by my involvement in river angling at club and national levels for many years being actively involved in all sorts of river based projects. I have also fished for barbel for many years having been taken up by the obsession in my teens. I am now sixty years old so that’s a long time spent in the pursuit of what I regard as the hardest fighting indigenous course river fish in the UK and beyond.

When the Barbel Society was first formed it was based upon sound foundations for the future of the species. Sadly over the years I have seen those foundations become eroded. Where once I saw dogged determination for the retention of the rivers close season, I now hear its chairman calling for a re-think of this most bastioned of BS principles. Where once I heard the rallying cry for an end to the practise of stocking barbel into still waters, I hear its chairman admitting there is little the BS can do about it. Year upon year its membership “IS†shrinking. Year upon year its fishery portfolio has shrunk to an all time low. Outside of its token membership in the AT, the BS has no influence on either river issues or issues related to the species.

When the BS enjoyed a membership going upwards towards 1200, it had a golden opportunity to gather up several times that amount as the rise in popularity for barbel fishing grew to an all time high. Opportunities to achieve this were squandered especially when its chairman decided to have a closed shop members only website forum and precious little else on its website to attract new members. Too much time was spent on negative political aspects. When the internet was boosting other angling organisations memberships, the BS website became a ghost town as it stagnated to a point where not even BS members were visiting it. Even with the rapid rise in social media, where 175 million people log in every day across the world, the BS has failed to harness this amazing phenomenon as a tool for recruitment.

The BS facebook page is now closed and one has to join the FB group to even view let alone post. Another lost opportunity.
Currently no democratically elected organisation represents the majority of UK barbel anglers. What there is in the form of the BS is an organisation run by one unelected man. This concerns me. It is also of concern to the vast majority of UK barbel anglers who are not in BS membership. I am concerned that the BS is broken. Concerned that nothing is being done to address this situation. Concerned that the previous concerns of ex committee men were not listened to. Concerned that calls for change within the organisation and outside of it have always fell on one set of totally deaf ears.

The Barbel Society could have been so much more. It could have been a real force for river fishing and the species it was founded upon to protect and preserve. Instead, it’s now seen by many as the failing fixation of just one unelected man.

Your enthusiasm , and the enthusiasm of many more like you within the BS is to be applauded Howard. But that alone will not stop the rot or bring about positive change for the future. Only a change of tenure will achieve that.

I am not a BS member Howard. But once was on two or three separate occasions. I left for the very same reasons I’ve listed above which is the total unwillingness to bring about change within the BS from its chairman.

As a prospective BS member what changes would I like to see implemented?

1. A reversal of the BS constitution back to the original one that was ratified after the formation meeting.
2. That there be free and democratic elections of all BS officers and committee personnel as agreed in the original BS constitution.
3. That a new BS form strong alliances with other river groups and clubs for the river habitat.
4. That the BS return to its founding principles fighting in defence of the species habitat and rivers close season.
5. That the BS form a vigorous and decisive campaign for membership recruitment and PR.
6. That the BS website be built to reflect the pure angling side of what heart stopping barbel catching is all about .

Regards,

Lee.
 
I have to challenge the post by Lee Fletcher, I am afraid, it is not informative at all, but full of misinformation and inaccuracy, as well as thinly veiled personal criticism of individuals which is quite unjustified.
As a Committee member for the last ten years, at least, and a founder member, I am in a position to correct Lee on his assertions, and advise others to seek the truth elsewhere, rather than rely on what appears to be an ill-informed attack on something he really seems to know very little about.

The BS Constitution is unchanged, other than some minor amendments three years ago to bring some statements up to date.
All members are supplied with it.
The main Officers/President/Vice Presidents are elected at the AGM.
The BS has strong alliances with the EA/Natural England/AT/several Rivers Trusts/Wild Trout Trust/various angling clubs and Universities.
The founding principles are unchanged.
There is a strong sub-committee working on PR and sustaining and improving membership, Howard Cooke is chairing it and working hard.
The website has been completely upgraded and relaunched, and is in the process of being enriched even further.
I urge people to take a look at it.

This thread was supposed to be an opportunity to inform all barbel anglers who look in on BFW about the positive aspects of the BS, not least the Research and Conservation side of things, which many members join to support. We also enjoy a positive relationship with BFW, and work together to collate and publish the River Records, for example.

The thread has been hijacked to an extent at times by one or two people who simply want to criticise, grind old and rusty axes, make snide remarks and rain negativity onto an attempt to be positive and involve all in the common good of barbel and barbel rivers. Some comments have been quite unpleasant and malevolent, but I am sure most folk that read them see them for what they are.

I would be happy to discuss all the above with Lee directly, or anyone else, but will not debate further on the matter here. The thread has gone off at a tangent, and I rarely get involved in these things, preferring to just get on with the job and ignore the inevitable sniping.

Take a look at the auction lots, the website and RandC summary in particular, and we would value any further support!

Kind regards,

Pete
 
Hi Howard,
please can I ask a couple of GENUINE questions?

What are the benefits/reasons/advantages of joining the BS?

How does the R&C work that the BS does benefit barbel/anglers/environment?

I've been a keen barbel angler for 40 odd years and have never felt the need to join.
Have I been missing something? Or doing the future of barbel/angling a disservice by not joining?

all the best, Tim

Hi Tim,

Apologies for the slightly long winded reply, but I wanted to offer a personal perspective to your question.

Compared to many perhaps, I am a newcomer to barbel, only really fishing for them specifically in the last 3 years. And that's after a 15 year absence from fishing of any description. To kick start my barbel fishing I booked a guiding session on the Kennet with Steve Pope. Steve was a very engaging companion, highly knowledgable and passionate about barbel fishing. It was also my first encounter with a centrepin and I even managed to hook and land a barbel on one. Well, you know more than anyone Tim the trouble that has got me into. Your 1 a.m. voicemail telling me about a Witcher that had just come up for sale on eBay was the start of my economic downfall. But what joy!

Like many I suppose I turned to the Internet for more guidance and insight on this barbel fishing malarkey and that's where I stumbled across BFW. So many knowledgable anglers happy to provide sincere advice and help. I now fish with a few of them and their tolerance of my stupid questions and general ineptitude is to be applauded. Rarely for me I even fell out with a few posters but it was quite easy to ignore that and concentrate on the positives.

Joining a group devoted to the species I had come to adore was a very natural step and when I read more about the BS, it was a very simple decision to join. What stood out for me was the devotion and focus on barbel and environment conservation. There may be those that argue with the execution or specific focus applied by the BS but the philosophy is what resonated. I have no expertise or time to contribute but I can certainly find £30 odd quid a year knowing it's helping to keep the oxygen going into an organisation seeking to do good. I throw more than that amount of money in the bin each year with the bait I buy but never use and let's not mention the various tackle items lying redundant in my shed. In a "what's in it for me now" world, investing in R&C effort that doesn't provide an instant return may not seem like a great way to spend money. That's never been my sentient however.

I think Pete Reading and the team do a fantastic job with limited resources (time, money, people) and much of it may go a little unnoticed unless people take the time to read the R&C section on the BS website. By his own admission, Pete doesn't parade in the social media spotlight and I don't blame him. It carries the very real risk of a diminished life force and you have to respect Pete's preference to simply get on with the job.

I don't get science but I do get its significance if you want to truly understand barbel and their environment. Particularly if you want to be able to appreciate the impact of actions and environmental trauma so that informed and decisive intervention can be made. It's all about the facts and that's the currency that the R&C efforts trade in. This has the potential to benefit all anglers, now and in the future as well as clubs and related organisations. Results from studies and projects shared, allowing those that engage with this aspect of fishing to perhaps change their approach or adapt their fishery rules accordingly.

So much more could be achieved and achieved more quickly with more resources and perhaps more critically, help and practical support from those with the time and expertise. Until then progress will be slow, but progress will be made. From time to time open requests have been made for data/scales etc and I'm not sure it's been as successful as it could have been. The barbel diet analysis is a case in point. A far more impactful and informative narrative could have been generated with more data from a wider selection of rivers. Some were quick to jump on the studies perceived short comings though.

Tim, you have a fantastic and inventive fishing brain, I've witnessed that myself on the bank (although I would exclude the moment you stole my rod so you could land a 2lb grayling) and perhaps there is a reverse to your original question, based on what you might be able to contribute into the BS through insight and knowledge sharing. So many new and young barbel anglers could learn an incredible amount from you.

The BS does need to adapt to remain relevant but that's a perfectly normal situation in an evolving world. It may surprise many that the strong advocates for change are those that many think incapable of it. Whatever changes occur, the core philosophy and focus of the BS should remain unchanged in my view.

Best regards.

Howard
 
In Reply

Dear Pete and Howard,

Thank you for your recent posts.

I fully intend to counter Pete's post with certain facts, not speculations regarding some of the information he provided in his post where he claims my post was full of misinformation.

Unfortunately, due to news we recieved at home at 2.0am this morning we have a sudden family bereavement to deal with.

In the meantime, the question I originally posed was not answered by Pete. That question being; Are funds raised by the R&C effort being used to prop up BS fisheries and expenses? One would assume that seeing as Pete heads up this initiative he would have been more than happy to answer this question?

Also in the meantime Peter before I have the time to respond fully, can you provide proof that all officer positions, including your position, and the positions of committee personnel were elected by the members at AGM like you claim by being proposed and seconded, or were they all "co-opted" mid term then merely ratified by a show of hands at AGM's? Also can you provide proof that the chairman was elected by the membership at AGM or EGM originally by the same means and that subsequent terms of his office were voted upon by the membership at AGM by being properly proposed and seconded.

I believe that for any organisation to remain healthy there needs to be clarity in the way it performs its functions for its members and not deal with issues behind closed doors. Openness and clarity are the protocols of successful membership recruitment therefore I will not be talking to you about these issues privately but on open forum here for all to see.

Regards,

Lee.
 
Lee, firstly and most importantly, I'm very sorry to hear of the family bereavement- my sincere condolences to you and your family.

I agree with your general sentiment concerning transparency. However, as you are not currently a member of the BS, some might wonder quite what it's got to do with you (and I should say that I don't mean it in quite the way it comes across in written word). As a member, that's a different matter of course so why not rejoin and take matters up from within the society. You are clearly mindful of due process and protocol so surely that should extend to your constitutional related challenges. I'm not sure it is fair to expect the BS to discuss and debate organisational matters raised by anyone on any open forum. I don't think other clubs/societies would be willing do this.

The Society is nothing without its members and it would be bizarre not to care about what members think. That's why members were asked to complete a feedback questionnaire sent with the last newsletter. Only a small number of replies have been received so far.

All the best.
 
I have only been a barbel angler for fifty years and have never felt the need to join any society.

The problem is that politics takes over from fishing and hierarchy lends a strong part.

People thinking that they are self important..

Let us just go fishing, please!

Hugo



 
I don't think you are far off the mark there Hugo. I really am a newcomer to barbel fishing, only been concentrating on them for literally a very few years...so of course I missed all the 'Barbel Wars' nonsense, only learning about the goings on second hand, as it were. The message that comes across loud and clear from some of those involved, and from outsiders looking in was that the whole thing was misnamed...it should have been called 'Ego Wars'.

Cheers, Dave.
 
Dave/Hugo,

I agree with you about egos and politics- they can be an enormous drain when you encounter them too frequently. But I maintain an open mind about most things and I do speak as I find, rarely relying on the opinion of others to form my own. In my dealings with the BS over the past year, I haven't encountered what others describe. As I have said before, my sole reason for joining the BS was because they have a core focus on research and conservation. Whilst that remains the case they will continue to receive my membership subs and wider support.

All the best you two.
 
Hi Pete, Howard,
many thanks for your replies.

I think my main incentive to join would be to support the R&C work, as the BS fisheries are too distant to be of much interest.

From a purely selfish point of view, the work being done on the Dorset Stour and Hampshire Avon would be my personal motivation to subscribe. These two rivers need all the help they can get (along with many others, of course).

Do you remember what the Stour used to be like Pete? Suicide swim on the Blackwater...those were the days! I can't bear to even look at it now. Could it ever be like that again?

all the best,
Tim
 
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